J:
Do you want to first introduce yourself?

G:
My name’s Geoff and I’m the owner of Freedom Skate Shop and an avid golfer.

J:
How often do you see the connection of golfers who like to skate and skaters who like to golf?

G:
All the time. The bulk majority of my friends that I golf with in town are also skaters. One of my skating buddies is actually going to be a caddy at Sand Valley this summer.

J:
Why do you think there is connective tissue between skate life and golf life? On the surface they seem quite different but the more I think about it, the vendiagram of the two, has more in the center than you’d probably think.

G:
Golfing much like skating is something that you can do on your own or with others. Many times, if I’m up early and can squeeze in 18 at the Bridges in under three hours and then get to work, that’s a good morning. Same with skating. There have been multiple mornings where I’ve gone to the skate park, people are there rolling around for a half hour before getting to work, whatever you’re doing in the day, it gets you started.

A lot of other sports and pastimes require a whole crew or team. Both golf and skating allow you to do them whenever you feel. Whether it’s the chipping green or driving range. You can do it at your own pace.

The other thing I’ve seen, at least in myself, is the connection to the mental aspect and physical aspect. The amount of strength and finesse you need in golf, to drive the ball and chip or putt, it’s the same with skating. Having the strength to jump down gaps or jump up ledges but to also have the coordination: eye-foot, eye-hand, to balance through grinds and be delicate with it.

J:
You have to be mentally rigorous.

G:
They talk about that in golf all the time. Commit to your shot.

J:
Trust it.

J:
What’s your origin for both golfing and skating? 
How did you get into one or the other?

G:
Golfing came first. When I was very young, there was a par 3 course on the south-side in my hometown of LaCrosse WI. There was a group of kids, 6-9 that I was in after school programs with, and we’d play in a league at the par 3. 

Then in middle school and high school, golf was non-existent. Skateboarding came into my life. In 1997 skating came in and consumed me. It was all I wanted to do. It was my whole pursuit. And it still is today. 

In 2007, I had an ankle injury from skating and was in a brace. It so happened to be a walking brace on my left ankle, my planted foot. One of my buddies, a really avid golfer, was moving down to Texas to work at a course and said hey, you can’t skate but you can ride in a cart and swing a club. 

I went out with him for a few rounds and got the bug and it bit me hard. That consumed the rest of my free time.

J:
Any golfer can relate to the bite of the proverbial bug. The first pure shot or clean contact. What’s the parallel point with skating? Is it the first time you drop in or land a certain trick? You’ll also have to forgive any misuses of skating terminology here.

G:
Nail on the head. When I was younger, I’d play rounds here and there but it wasn’t until the summer I was injured that I did it consistently. And it went from hitting crazy slices and duffing shots to having a buddy who helped teach me, change this, do this, and then yes, you do start hitting pure shots. You go from one par once a round to stringing together three or four. 

That first chip shot that you never thought would hole out, and then you hole out, you lose it. 
That first time you drop in or land a kick flip or ollie a stair set, this rush comes over you like holy hell, I can do it.

When you’re skating or in the middle of that shot, nothing else matters.
That is all you’re focused on.
Pure peace. 

J:
Do you find skating restful or relaxing? 

G:
Yes in a certain circumstance. Sometimes the most fun experience skating is just cruising. Not working on a trick or snapping photos. Sometimes just going to the park and hopping in the bowl and carving. Just basic grinds. It can be very chill and relaxing.

J:
I’ve noticed feeling so relaxed golfing lately. Feeling confident in my game and not worrying about getting too much better or hopefully not too much worse, just being outside and with my friends or even by myself. Exercising, walking. I feel so relaxed by the end of the round. 

G:
Some of my favorite times skating are early in the morning when there’s the silhouette around the capitol. Or golfing when the sun rises just above the trees and it’s just you and a buddy. Water rising off of the pond. It’s just serene. 

For skaters, and I’m sure it’s not just me. When I’m sitting at the shop and I hear wheels rolling down the street, it’s that sound. I just love that sound. A smooth bearing rolling. The smooth grind on a ledge. An effortless grind. That sound is just soothing.

J:
There’s a poetry to it.

G:
It’s just relaxing and comfortable.

J:
Sitting in your beautiful store, I’m struck in skate culture by the role of aesthetics. There’s so much that goes into the designs on the boards, the designs on the clothing. It’s filled with art, filled with design, filled with an aesthetic communication. 

Why do you think that’s the case? It seems to me that more so than other sports or cultures, skate life involves more of a visual component than others.

G:
Like in art or music, skateboarding has a creative aspect. At the parks, there is a creative aspect in finding unique obstacles to skate. As well as finding your own style. What avenue of skating works for you. Some like ledge skating. Some like transitions. Some like purely cruising. Some like bombing down hills. 

J:
There’s no exact path to get from point a to point b. There’s a lot of creative problem solving and individual perspective that comes into how you hit a shot or approach a trick. There’s a lot of personality that is imbued in that, that perhaps translates into the aesthetic expression of skaters. There’s a wholeness to the culture but you’re also showing your individual flavor and style, and you can communicate that in all sorts of ways.

G:
Everyone has their own style in skateboarding. No swing in golf is the same. Look at Furyk’s crazy loop swing. And then Tiger or Rory, that is the most mechanically sound, trained swing. People like Couples or Els, just have this effortless, natural swing. They’ve made it work. 

J:

I read about the dilettante effect. Someone who is new to an effort. Like with musicians. Someone who is trained at Juilliard is going to play an instrument a specific way but then you hand a novice that same instrument and they’ll play with some experimentation and personality and perhaps discover a new way of approaching playing it. Seems like you could see a similar effect with skaters.

G:
Thinking outside of the box. People coming into skateboarding and finding that there is a general characteristic of doing an ollie. But foot position and how your body reacts can all change. Someone might find an easier way to do a grind or slide or transitions. 

Now there’s a template that people have used to achieve said objective, whether it’s music, a golf swing or a trick, but people can find new ways to get to that end result. Some ways might be better. Some might be worse.

J:
That generally proves out over time.

G:
You can still get to that end point and figure out what works for you. So long as you’re hitting the center of that club face, that’s all that matters. As long as you’re dropping in, it doesn’t matter how fluid or how you make it look. 

You’re still accomplishing that same end goal.

J:
Can you tell me how Freedom Skate Shop came to be and also what the skate community is like in Madison?

G:
Freedom Skate Shop originally started in 1998 and had different owners. I moved back to Madison from California in 2014, spent some time in the skate industry, and then had an opportunity to step into ownership in 2016.

Our community here is close knit. Owning a skate shop, I know probably 90% of the people who skate in Madison. For the size of the city, our scene is robust and we have a lot of really good support. We all work together. 

Given the size of our city and the number of skaters we have here, I would say it is flourishing.
It’s a good spot to be in. 

J:
Was there a covid bump in skating like there was with golf? 

G:
We saw that same influx in skating like with other outdoor activities. You can do it on your own. All you need is a parking lot. You had a lot of people who were skating as an outdoor activity coupled with people looking for something new. I saw our industry boom for those couple of years. 

J:
We have behind us an assortment of magazines and VHS. You’ve mentioned filming tricks at the park. Why does media and documentation hold such a heavy hand in skate culture?

G:
Very much in the ‘70s and ‘80s, through the evolution of skateboarding, one of the lures has been finding unique places to skate and paving your own way in skateboarding. To capture those moments, those places, those unique tricks you’ve done. That was the catalyst that kept the progression of skateboarding going. 

This was my very first skate video I’ve ever owned (The Sixth Sense). It came out in 1998 which means a lot of the footage is from 97. Before the internet and websites were a thing. Seeing new tricks in new areas. This was how you learned and kept up on what was going on. 

There was no-one teaching you. You had to learn on your own and watch skate videos; slow it down, then rewind it. Watch it again. I would watch this video (Sixth Sense) everyday before I’d go out to try and figure out how to do a nose grind. 

J:
You really have to be a student of these tricks and what’s gone before you to keep it moving forward. You’re really tied to the history in a beautiful way.

G:
A bulk majority of skate tricks would not be able to have been done without someone inventing the ollie. If that trick never would’ve been figured out, the bulk majority of tricks today wouldn’t be possible. 

J:
It seems like there’s a similarity with surf culture where there’s this hunt for the next and biggest wave, and doing things people haven’t done before.

G:
Skateboarding is derived from surfing. Back in the day, when somebody couldn’t surf, dudes would find ditches and make boards, and carve around like side to side surfing. 

J:
Biggest misconception about skateboarders?

G:
Rebels. That is a stigma that has followed skateboarders for so long that is changing now. I go skateboarding with friends that are doctors, lawyers. People that have worked in city hall and office. We’re not all punks.

J:
Biggest faux pas at the skate park? Like if I show up wearing heelie shoes or bring a razor scooter. How’s that going to go over?

G:
Generally, the cool thing for us, is that the scene here in Madison is pretty chill. I’ve seen bikers show up or people in heelies. We will however ask you to do a trick on them. 

J:
Best all time skating video game?

G:
Tony Hawk Pro Skater 2. THPS2. I still have it on 64. 

J:
64 is also the greatest console ever.

G:
I like THPS2 because you can get into manuals on it. 

J:
How would you like to see skate culture grow in Madison or writ large?

G:
Continuing in the direction that we have now. Back in the day, skateboarding had been very much bro-culture; cliquey. Now, seeing it opening up to more people. Seeing more women in skateboarding. Younger kids getting into it. Building more places for people to skate. Showing that it’s not just a bunch of punks. Showing that inclusive environment. 

J:
Can you put a plug to get a park on the west side of Madison?

G:
They’re due.

J:
Dream trick for you to pull off at a park? It’s Geoff and a crowd of thousands. Everyone waiting with bated breath.

G:
The trick that I’ve done before is a switch heel flip to switch manual. I have it documented and would love to one day do it again. 

Pie in the sky, trick I’ve never done: ollie heel flip to front side nose grind. I’ve done it as a manual but doing it as a grind, is something I’ve always wanted to do. The body is not as limber as it once was. 

J:
But the mind is stronger. 

Favorite all time skater?
Favorite all time golfer?

G:
Freddie Couples. Just fluid, smooth swing. Power with that finesse. Silky smooth. Dunks the shot at TPC sawgrass then jars the second for par. No emotion. Just such a cool dude.

Also shout out local legend Jerry Kelly. 

Brian Anderson. Kenny Anderson. Josh Kalis. Watching them and getting to meet some of them was very influential. Well rounded. I modeled a lot of my skating after Kalis. But Bryan and Kenny Anderson are just pioneers of skating. 

J: 
Dream foursome? Anyone in the world. Preferably living.

G:
Arnie. 

J:
Schwarzenegger or Palmer?

G.
Palmer. 

And then, probably Jerry. Local Madison dude. He’s a legend.
Tiger. I grew up in that era of watching him and his dominance. 
There’s all the usuals. Jordan. JT. Rory. 

Viktor Hovland. Seems like a really nice guy.
I believe he has a farm in Oklahoma where he was living.
And he’s crushing it.

J:
Final question. What first comes to mind when you hear our Good Lion mantra, GOOD > SAFE? 

G:
My first inkling being a golfer is no laying up. If it’s a 300 yard Par 4, you better not be pulling 5 iron. Have the confidence and commit to what you’re doing. Make it solid.

You can be safe. 
Second guessing yourself. 
Holding back. 
Maybe not taking the risk. 

If I would never have taken that risk, taking over the shop, you know, we wouldn’t be going on over a decade doing what I love. 
Good is better than safe. 

Huge thanks to Geoff for taking the time out to chat.
If you want to watch an uncut video of the full interview, check it out below.